Is There a Fair Way to Divide Us? (Update) | People I (Mostly) Admire

Freakonomics Radio Network Freakonomics Radio Network Oct 20, 2025

Audio Brief

Show transcript
In this conversation, mathematician Moon Duchin explains how modern computational methods are being applied to analyze and combat political gerrymandering. There are three key takeaways from this discussion. First, modern mathematics provides an objective tool to identify gerrymandering. The core challenge in proving a map is gerrymandered has been the lack of a baseline for what a normal or fair map looks like. Mathematicians now use algorithms to generate massive ensembles of legally valid district plans. This creates a distribution of typical outcomes, allowing them to identify partisan maps as statistical outliers. Second, a 'neutral' redistricting process is not necessarily 'fair'. Even a blind map-drawing algorithm can produce consistently biased results due to the natural geographic clustering of voters. This means a process considered neutral may still inherently favor one party, highlighting a crucial distinction between process neutrality and outcome fairness. Third, the ultimate solution to unfair representation may require fundamental systemic changes. The conversation suggests moving beyond just drawing better maps to adopting alternative voting systems. Examples include multi-member districts with ranked-choice voting, which aim to achieve more proportional representation and address the underlying issues inherent in single-winner districts. These insights underscore the critical role of data science and thoughtful systemic reform in strengthening democratic integrity.

Episode Overview

  • Mathematician Moon Duchin explains her journey from abstract geometry to applying computational methods to solve the problem of political gerrymandering.
  • The discussion centers on the core challenge of identifying gerrymandered maps: the lack of a baseline for what a "normal" or "fair" map looks like.
  • Duchin details how her team developed algorithms to generate a massive "ensemble" of legally valid district plans, allowing them to identify partisan maps as statistical outliers.
  • The conversation explores the crucial and non-intuitive distinction between a "neutral" map-drawing process and a genuinely "fair" political outcome.
  • The podcast concludes by considering that a more fundamental solution may lie in changing voting systems, such as adopting multi-member districts with ranked-choice voting.

Key Concepts

  • Gerrymandering vs. Redistricting: Redistricting is the required decennial process of redrawing electoral maps, while gerrymandering is the manipulation of those maps for partisan advantage using strategies like "packing" and "cracking."
  • The Baseline Problem: The fundamental difficulty in proving a map is gerrymandered is the lack of a neutral baseline for comparison. The number of possible valid maps is astronomically large (a "googol"), making it impossible to know what a "typical" map looks like without advanced methods.
  • The Ensemble Method (Markov Chains): Mathematicians use algorithms, specifically Markov Chain Monte Carlo methods, to sample the "wilderness" of all possible maps. By generating a large, representative sample (an "ensemble"), they can create a distribution of typical outcomes.
  • Outlier Analysis: A proposed or enacted districting map is compared against the baseline distribution created by the ensemble. If its partisan outcome is an extreme statistical outlier (e.g., more partisan than 99% of the neutral plans), it provides strong evidence of gerrymandering.
  • Neutrality vs. Fairness: A key insight is that a "blind" or "neutral" map-drawing process does not guarantee a fair outcome. The natural geographic clustering of voters (e.g., Democrats in cities) can mean that even randomly drawn maps will consistently favor one party.
  • Alternative Voting Systems: As a potential solution to the inherent problems of single-winner districts, the conversation touches on moving towards systems like multi-member districts and ranked-choice voting to achieve more proportional representation.

Quotes

  • At 0:01:13 - "We don't have a baseline. We don't know what normal districting looks like." - Duchin explaining the core problem that makes it difficult for courts to rule on gerrymandering.
  • At 0:21:30 - "I don't know, maybe you have a hundred, maybe you have 25, I guess there's probably thousands, he said. Actually, probably the right scale to think about is a googol." - Duchin highlighting the sheer combinatorial complexity of the problem, quoting an exchange involving Justice Alito.
  • At 0:27:16 - "My research group came along and came up with something that's analogous to the riffle shuffle... a big way to change plans one step at a time." - Duchin explaining her team's key innovation in developing more efficient algorithms to sample the universe of possible district plans.
  • At 29:17 - "That doesn't mean it's fair. Because of where people live in Pennsylvania... the geography was such that that blind draw of plans was really quite favorable to Republicans." - Duchin distinguishing between a statistically "neutral" process and a "fair" outcome, noting that natural population distribution can create inherent bias.
  • At 30:14 - "I remember when I said in the courtroom that blind isn't always fair, laughs went up around the courtroom. They thought I was joking." - Duchin sharing an anecdote that illustrates how counterintuitive and misunderstood the concept of fairness vs. blindness is, even in legal settings.

Takeaways

  • Modern mathematics provides a powerful, objective tool to combat gerrymandering by creating a baseline of "normal" maps to prove when a specific plan is a statistical outlier.
  • A "neutral" or "blind" redistricting process is not the same as a "fair" one; the underlying geography of how voters live can create a natural advantage for one party even in computer-generated maps.
  • Judging a district by its shape is a poor indicator of its fairness, as visually "reasonable" plans can still be profoundly unfair in their political outcomes.
  • The ultimate solution to unfair representation may not be better maps, but a move towards alternative voting systems like multi-member districts and ranked-choice voting.