SaaS is Dead. Long Live New SaaS.

Episode Overview

• This episode covers the pervasive influence of AI on business, contrasting the slower adoption in New Zealand with the aggressive integration in America, while also exploring the practical pitfalls and productivity benefits of generative AI tools.
• Founder Nick Mowbray shares his counterintuitive business philosophies, emphasizing the power of authenticity, building an "abnormal" high-performance culture, and challenging traditional SaaS models with a focus on a two-year payback period.
• The conversation delves into the realities of entrepreneurship, including the relentless persistence required for fundraising, the importance of managing a founder's high energy to avoid burnout, and the true, unglamorous nature of a CEO's responsibilities.
• Key themes include leveraging your unique cultural identity as a competitive advantage, the strategic value of hiring proven teams, and the critical shift in skills from content creation to expert editing and curation in an AI-driven world.

Key Concepts

• AI's Business Dominance: AI has become the central topic in all business conversations, though adoption rates and attitudes vary significantly between regions like the US and New Zealand.
• AI-Washing vs. Genuine AI: There is a prevalent, frustrating trend of companies applying the "AI" label to products without substance, contrasted with genuine AI which is fundamentally fueled by data.
• Generative AI Pitfalls: Generative AI tools are prone to "hallucinations," confidently presenting fabricated information, which requires vigilant human verification. Common tells of AI-generated content include overuse of em-dashes and specific formatting templates.
• Authenticity as a Differentiator: Instead of assimilating to foreign business cultures (e.g., American directness), embracing and framing one's authentic cultural identity ("Kiwi-ness") can make you more memorable and interesting.
• "Abnormal" High-Performance Culture: To achieve extraordinary results, companies must cultivate an "abnormal" culture of relentless drive, aggression, and an "express pace," rejecting average mindsets.
• The "New SaaS" Model: A modern approach to SaaS that rejects long-term customer payback periods (e.g., 8 years) in favor of a disciplined, two-year payback model, which forces a sharp focus on key metrics like ARPU.
• Customer-Centric Innovation: True product innovation is born from a deep and constant connection to customer problems, discovered through direct and frequent engagement.
• Strategic Team Acquisition: A powerful hiring strategy involves acquiring entire high-performing teams from other companies (e.g., Xero's former AI team) to rapidly build new capabilities.
• The Founder's Energy Paradox: A founder's intense energy is a double-edged sword; it can drive the company forward but can also be detrimental to the team if not managed with self-awareness.
• The Reality of the CEO Role: A common misconception is that CEOs delegate all the unpleasant tasks; in reality, a CEO's primary job is to find and solve the company's biggest and most difficult problems.

Quotes

• At 0:00 - "Every conversation at a business level, no matter where you are, is all about AI." - The speaker is highlighting how AI has become the dominant topic in all business discussions globally.
• At 0:27 - "They don't want you to be a shrinking violet... if you're introducing yourself, you need to state your credentials and your confidence up front." - Explaining the American business culture's expectation of directness and self-assurance.
• At 0:35 - "I'm an entrepreneur. Now, I'm not a suit and tie CEO for hire... That's not me." - The speaker defines his leadership style as authentic and entrepreneurial, distinguishing it from a more traditional corporate executive role.
• At 1:22 - "Everyone says, 'Oh we've got an AI product, we've got an AI product,' and it just makes me want to throw up in my mouth a little... Just stop saying it." - Expressing his frustration with companies that overuse the term "AI" as a buzzword.
• At 25:25 - "AI is just when it's wrong, it's confidently wrong. It's just so blatantly, confidently wrong, and if you don't check it, you're just like, 'Oh that sounds good,' and publish." - Finn describing the danger of AI "hallucinations" and the importance of fact-checking.
• At 26:58 - "It gives me the bare bones of where I can start because I'm Captain ADHD, I'm always running off to the next task." - Troy explaining his personal use of ChatGPT as a tool to overcome writer's block and improve his productivity.
• At 30:25 - "I just think that everyone is just going to become an editor more than they are a writer... and being an editor is a very particular skill set." - Finn predicting that as AI tools become ubiquitous, the most valuable human skill will shift from content creation to curation and editing.
• At 56:21 - "I just thought, 'I want to be my authentic self.'" - Nick explains his decision to stop worrying about adapting his speech for American audiences and instead embrace his Kiwi identity as a business strategy.
• At 57:13 - "I become interesting... They can do business with anyone that is more successful than I am... so why are they going to do business with me? I've got to be interesting." - Nick Mowbray on why being his authentic self is a crucial competitive advantage that makes him stand out.
• At 58:51 - "That's always the way I want to be. I never want to be in the middle." - Nick reinforcing his belief in being polarizing rather than mediocre.
• At 1:01:21 - "The old way of doing things was, 'I'm going to keep a customer for eight years, take a longer view'... I take a two-year period, and everything after that is a bonus." - Nick describes his "New SaaS" model, which prioritizes a much shorter ROI timeframe.
• At 1:04:40 - "One of our great hires was Sam Daish, who's the ex-Chief of Data and Strategy at Xero... We've got our AI crew... they were all the AI team under Sam at Xero." - Nick reveals how they built their AI team by hiring a ready-made, high-performing team.
• At 86:26 - "If you want great music, you have to have the highs, right? And so, you know, all the lows... they both create great music." - Nick uses a music analogy to explain that both high and low energy periods are essential parts of the entrepreneurial process.
• At 87:07 - "That's actually the last place I should be, because I'd bring in a stink with me. So I stay at home and everyone loves me for it." - Nick explains that he has learned to recognize when he is overworked and in a bad mood, and that staying away from the team is better for everyone.
• At 88:04 - "Are you really pushing it hard enough?" - Nick reflects on the founder's mentality, suggesting that if you're not close to a breaking point, you might not be pushing as hard as you could be.
• At 90:17 - "I'm not coming home. I've missed a lot of stuff... I'm just not fucking giving up." - Nick describes his relentless mindset while struggling to secure investment during a grueling trip to the United States.
• At 91:59 - "I literally bust into a cold sweat and start playing the whole conversation back in my head. I was like, 'I've fucked this up.'" - Nick recalls his panicked reaction after pitching to investor Tim Crown, before knowing who he was.
• At 94:58 - "You're accountable to the public. You have public people's money. You have to... you're beholden to them." - Nick explains the immense sense of responsibility and motivation that comes from having public shareholders.
• At 95:05 - "Your job is to deal with the nastiest and worst shit... you don't get rid of the shit jobs, you... your job is to find the worst one and do it." - Nick shares what he believes is the biggest misconception about being a CEO.
• At 102:50 - "It actually forces disciplines that you would never put on yourself in a private company." - Nick discusses the benefits of being a publicly listed company, noting the rigorous accountability it demands.

Takeaways

• To succeed in international markets like the US, adopt a direct communication style and state your credentials with confidence, rather than using passive language.
• Use your unique cultural background as a strategic advantage; framing your authenticity upfront makes you more memorable than trying to perfectly blend in.
• Treat AI as a productivity tool to create a "bare bones" first draft, but recognize that your primary role is to edit, verify, and add human character to the output.
• Develop your skills as an editor and curator, as these will become more valuable than pure content creation in an AI-assisted world.
• To build a truly innovative product, immerse yourself in your customers' problems daily; let their pain points be the direct source of your inspiration.
• Challenge traditional business models by focusing on shorter payback periods (e.g., two years), which instills financial discipline and a focus on high-value customers.
• Accelerate development and de-risk hiring by acquiring proven, high-performing teams from established companies instead of building from scratch one individual at a time.
• As a leader, practice self-awareness to manage your energy; know when to step away from your team to avoid projecting stress and negativity.
• Embrace a relentless "win or die trying" mentality, as extraordinary success requires an abnormal level of persistence and effort.
• Understand that the role of a leader is not to delegate unwanted tasks, but to actively seek out and solve the organization's most difficult and critical problems.
• Never underestimate the power of persistence and serendipity; staying in the game long enough, even through constant rejection, is what creates opportunities for "one-in-a-million" chances.
• View the constraints of being a publicly listed company not as a burden, but as a framework that enforces discipline and accountability you might not otherwise impose on yourself.