EP33 Sledgehammer and Big Shot

Episode Overview

• This episode is an interview with Henry Sledge, son of the renowned World War II Marine veteran and author, E.B. Sledge, whose memoir With the Old Breed is a classic of war literature.
• The conversation provides a deep dive into the unique brutality and immense psychological trauma of the Pacific War, contrasting it with the European theater.
• Key themes include the struggle to maintain one's humanity amidst the horror of combat, the stoic nature of the WWII generation in handling trauma, and the communication gap between veterans and civilians.
• The discussion culminates with the perspective of a frontline veteran on the planned invasion of Japan and the widespread belief that the use of the atomic bomb saved countless American lives.

Key Concepts

• The Nature of the Pacific War: The war in the Pacific is described as a uniquely brutal "war of extermination," characterized by constant psychological stress, sleep deprivation, a no-surrender enemy, and visceral racial animosity.
• Trauma and Humanity: A central theme is how soldiers like E.B. Sledge endured the dehumanizing crucible of war while consciously fighting to retain their decency and sanity.
• Generational Stoicism: The discussion highlights the quiet, stoic approach of the WWII generation in processing trauma, often keeping their experiences private and focusing on moving forward with their lives productively.
• The Veteran's Context: The podcast explores the difficulty veterans have in communicating their experiences to civilians, as their shared language and raw memories create a world that is nearly impossible for outsiders to fully comprehend.
• E.B. Sledge's Legacy: The conversation reinforces the importance of E.B. Sledge's memoir, With the Old Breed, and his posthumous fame through the HBO series The Pacific, which brought his unflinching account to a modern audience.

Quotes

• At 40:18 - "Yeah, I knew him on Peleliu. He got the shit knocked out of him by a close shell hit." - Henry Sledge recounts overhearing his father, a man who rarely used profanity, speaking this way to another veteran, revealing the unique and raw language veterans used among themselves to describe their shared trauma.
• At 47:46 - "I was not going to let them take my sanity." - Henry Sledge quoting his father, Eugene Sledge, on his determination to maintain his mental state despite the horrific conditions and brutal enemy tactics in the Pacific War.
• At 51:00 - "The longer we stayed in that terrible place... our environment congealed more and more into a ghastly nightmare of mud, murderous shelling, casualties, rotting bodies, and maggots." - Dan Carlin reads a harrowing passage from Eugene Sledge's unpublished writings describing the horrific conditions on Okinawa.
• At 1:07:30 - "Get used to killing women and children, because you're going to have to." - Henry Sledge relays what his father and other Marines were told in preparation for the invasion of the Japanese home islands, highlighting the brutal expectations of that final campaign.
• At 1:09:08 - "It saved my life. It saved my life." - Dan Carlin quotes the common sentiment of WWII veterans, including his own stepfather, regarding the atomic bomb, emphasizing their belief that it prevented an even bloodier invasion of Japan.

Takeaways

• The Pacific War's psychological toll was as significant as its physical brutality, largely due to the constant, close-quarters nature of the fighting and an enemy that rarely surrendered.
• Maintaining one's sanity and humanity in the face of industrial-scale slaughter was an active, conscious struggle for soldiers like E.B. Sledge.
• The veteran's perspective is crucial for understanding historical events; for many preparing to invade Japan, the atomic bomb was not a moral quandary but a life-saving deliverance.
• There exists a profound gap in understanding between those who have experienced combat and those who have not, which is bridged by firsthand accounts like With the Old Breed.